http://orlando.craigslist.org/car/523287293.html
Its a beautiful car, and enthusiast owned but is a 1991 m5 worth 5-10k less then a 2000 m5. There are many many low to mid mileage third generation m5's in the central florida area for 20-35k.
I looked at kbb at its like 7k for this car. Granted I don't put a lot of stock in kbb since according to them most of us would have to pay someone to take our e28 off of our hands but..........
I know e28 m5's can go for 10-15k depending on condition, but isn't that due to the relative rarity of an e28 m5 vs an e34 m5??
What do you guys think?
I'm looking at a members 535is as well for 5k that is in good shape but I'm looking at buying two vehicles and considered maybe picking up the e28 535is and another bmw (e38 740i, e34 m5, 530, or 540) or a pickup as the second vehicle.
Currently I have a e28 535i which is a project car in need of a lot of work (mechanically fine but needs electric and cosmetic) and a old jeep that is on its last leg at 200k.
Rob
Is this the going rate for a 1991 m5
A lot of the ones I see are in the 10-13k range. Being a '91, it doesn't have the most powerful motor of the E34 cars, but it could bring that price if it is indeed nice. Of course, if you look at the E28 M5, there are many that will sell in that range, with several exceeding it, and of course your few ugly ducklings that fall below.
I guess these cars are still somewhat exclusive, as a non-production line car and they do have the S38, so it's the last straight-6 M5. They made a helluva lot more of the E39s, and to many they're just a used E39 with a big V8 and a lot of mondo-expensive stuff to repair, so that might have something to do with them being only 10k more expensive. I would say based on the age/price difference of the E39 to E34 compared with the E34 to E28, the E34 M5 might be a bargain, but who can really decide that?
I guess these cars are still somewhat exclusive, as a non-production line car and they do have the S38, so it's the last straight-6 M5. They made a helluva lot more of the E39s, and to many they're just a used E39 with a big V8 and a lot of mondo-expensive stuff to repair, so that might have something to do with them being only 10k more expensive. I would say based on the age/price difference of the E39 to E34 compared with the E34 to E28, the E34 M5 might be a bargain, but who can really decide that?
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Bryan in SB
- Posts: 2002
- Joined: Feb 12, 2006 12:00 PM
'Couple of things are causing odd prices in the M5 market.
1. The E28's are maintaining if not creeping up in price. Being the oldest of the quartet, and in my eyes the truest form, it's benefitting in regards to it's age. It's almost a classic. It's sought after by enthusiasts who want to feel the road, to get positive steering feedback, and to be in a car that is smaller than later models.
2. The E34's are generally owned by people who can't afford the E39, or want something newer than the E28. Granted, I said generally, their pricing has been in the $11-$19k range for the most part. Low mileage, well kept cars command a premium and are found in the $22k to $28k range. This is a huge jump over the normal E34 M5 range, but I suspect, is kept high by owners and sellers who know how great a car this is.
3. The E39's are getting dumped. Plain and simple. There are a ton of them hitting the used market, and the high volume is driving prices waaaay down. That, and I suspect, the current owners willingness to take it in the shorts to fund their new M5 or Ferrari 430, is what is causing the downward spiral in E39 pricing.
I came within minutes of buying an E34 M5 before I bought my Euro M5, but am glad I didn't. A check by a mechanic brought up a ton of issues. That said, I would still like to get ahold of an E34M5, however, with the way pricing is going on E39's, I might just skip it.
If you're looking for ROI or at least a car that holds it's value, go older. They'll be the ones that go up sooner.
1. The E28's are maintaining if not creeping up in price. Being the oldest of the quartet, and in my eyes the truest form, it's benefitting in regards to it's age. It's almost a classic. It's sought after by enthusiasts who want to feel the road, to get positive steering feedback, and to be in a car that is smaller than later models.
2. The E34's are generally owned by people who can't afford the E39, or want something newer than the E28. Granted, I said generally, their pricing has been in the $11-$19k range for the most part. Low mileage, well kept cars command a premium and are found in the $22k to $28k range. This is a huge jump over the normal E34 M5 range, but I suspect, is kept high by owners and sellers who know how great a car this is.
3. The E39's are getting dumped. Plain and simple. There are a ton of them hitting the used market, and the high volume is driving prices waaaay down. That, and I suspect, the current owners willingness to take it in the shorts to fund their new M5 or Ferrari 430, is what is causing the downward spiral in E39 pricing.
I came within minutes of buying an E34 M5 before I bought my Euro M5, but am glad I didn't. A check by a mechanic brought up a ton of issues. That said, I would still like to get ahold of an E34M5, however, with the way pricing is going on E39's, I might just skip it.
If you're looking for ROI or at least a car that holds it's value, go older. They'll be the ones that go up sooner.
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rlomba8204
- Posts: 4869
- Joined: Feb 12, 2006 12:00 PM
- Location: Washington, DC
This part of you advice is terrible. Never, ever buy a car with the expectation it will hold value, or increase in value. If you want to drive it, this will not happen. If you don't drive it, it still will probably not happen.Bryan in SB wrote: If you're looking for ROI or at least a car that holds it's value, go older. They'll be the ones that go up sooner.
E34 M5s are great cars. Buy one to enjoy. If you want something that will hold its value or go up in value, with very few exceptions not worth mentioning here, you should stay away from cars.
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Tammer in Philly
- Posts: 10719
- Joined: Feb 12, 2006 12:00 PM
- Location: CHI, IL
Agree and disagree. You're right that they won't hold value, especially as the dollar loses value over time. BUT, buying a nicer, older car is most likely to get you a well-maintained and therefore cheaper-to-own car. Depreciation will be less drastic, and if it has been enthusiast-owned its whole life, it shouldn't be a mess of deferred maintenance.rlomba8204 wrote:This part of you advice is terrible. Never, ever buy a car with the expectation it will hold value, or increase in value. If you want to drive it, this will not happen. If you don't drive it, it still will probably not happen.Bryan in SB wrote: If you're looking for ROI or at least a car that holds it's value, go older. They'll be the ones that go up sooner.
E34 M5s are great cars. Buy one to enjoy. If you want something that will hold its value or go up in value, with very few exceptions not worth mentioning here, you should stay away from cars.
The E39 M5 is an unbelievable bargain in the market right now. There's no reason to stay away from them, but for a long-term prospect the E34 is "cooler." The last of the hand-built M5s.
-tammer
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muleskinner
- Posts: 1339
- Joined: Sep 08, 2007 11:17 AM
- Location: John Graham ATL
Before I bought my e28 "is" recently, I looked at several e28 ///M5s and 3 or 4 e34 ///M5s.
In decent shape, they're bringing $10-$14K.
This car looks in above average condition, so if you could snag it for $13K, assuming it's in as good mechanical condition as the cosmetic condition appears, it's a damn nice car for the money.
john
In decent shape, they're bringing $10-$14K.
This car looks in above average condition, so if you could snag it for $13K, assuming it's in as good mechanical condition as the cosmetic condition appears, it's a damn nice car for the money.
john
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Jon in Richmond
- Posts: 1389
- Joined: Feb 12, 2006 12:00 PM
I believe that this is Mel Abraham's (of abrahamsmotorsport.com) old M5. If so, I believe I remember that the current owner bought the car for around $12,000. You can check on Bimmerforums, do a search.
Unless the current owner has done a great deal of work, you might be able to talk him down a couple thousand.
Unless the current owner has done a great deal of work, you might be able to talk him down a couple thousand.
Last edited by Jon in Richmond on Jan 09, 2008 10:16 PM, edited 1 time in total.
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rlomba8204
- Posts: 4869
- Joined: Feb 12, 2006 12:00 PM
- Location: Washington, DC
Tammer-Tammer in Philly wrote:Agree and disagree. You're right that they won't hold value, especially as the dollar loses value over time. BUT, buying a nicer, older car is most likely to get you a well-maintained and therefore cheaper-to-own car. Depreciation will be less drastic, and if it has been enthusiast-owned its whole life, it shouldn't be a mess of deferred maintenance.rlomba8204 wrote:This part of you advice is terrible. Never, ever buy a car with the expectation it will hold value, or increase in value. If you want to drive it, this will not happen. If you don't drive it, it still will probably not happen.Bryan in SB wrote: If you're looking for ROI or at least a car that holds it's value, go older. They'll be the ones that go up sooner.
E34 M5s are great cars. Buy one to enjoy. If you want something that will hold its value or go up in value, with very few exceptions not worth mentioning here, you should stay away from cars.
The E39 M5 is an unbelievable bargain in the market right now. There's no reason to stay away from them, but for a long-term prospect the E34 is "cooler." The last of the hand-built M5s.
-tammer
Agreed. I didn't say it wasn't cheaper to own one used than new. That's a given because depreciation is the most expensive part of car ownership period, and currency fluctations are a given so I am comfortable making this statement, irrespective of currency adjustments.
But to buy a car like the e34 M5, e39 M5, etc. as anything other than a toy, and an expensive one at that, is silly. Is it cheaper than an e60 M5 or E63 AMG? Sure. But that's not to say it's cheap.
Hope you are well.
I'm the proud owner of a very, very, clean 1991 e34 m5 with 113k miles. Original bay area car bought from sonnen in marin and serviced meticously from day 1. I have a binder full of maintenance on this car that basically helped me in my purchasing decision. The car has some nice mods similiar to the ones in this ad but otherwise is stock which I think will help me once I decide to part ways with it. I've owned a 1988 e28 m5 and now this 1991 m5 and they are both excellent cars. Very engaging and both extremely limited production cars. Not many s38 m5's e34 in the us anymore either. I've also owned a e39 m5 and really didn't enjoy driving it like I did my e34 or e28. My e34 probably would get beat by my 535i off the line but from 50-90 mph forget about it. The car just takes off after 5rpm.
I purchased my e34 m5 last year for around 13k so the price in this ad seems reasonable given the condition and rarity of this car. I'm going to bring mine to 5er fest this year because e34's are allowed and if somebody throws out a good offer I will sell it. My heart has always been with an e28 m5...
I purchased my e34 m5 last year for around 13k so the price in this ad seems reasonable given the condition and rarity of this car. I'm going to bring mine to 5er fest this year because e34's are allowed and if somebody throws out a good offer I will sell it. My heart has always been with an e28 m5...
rob,
my only advice is to do your HOMEWORK on the e34 m5, definately get a third party vehicle inspection and try to lean towards examples that are very close to stock form. Though a very good car the e34 m5 can be very expensive to make right. I can't stress CARFAX check enough, a lot of these cars have/carry salvage titles due to accidents, theft etc. Most of the sellers won't tell you that as they are trying to flip the car.
I've owned and recently sold a 91 stock e34 m5. I found it on autotrader. It was out of Mass via Cali, one owner for 11k with 130k miles and a ton of paperwork. I sold it to a very good friend after I tracked down and purchased 01 Dinan 540i 6spd out of Ohio. I was looking for an M but couldn't find one with decent miles for 25k. I've also owned an e28 m5 for 2yrs. That one was the most fun. The e34 has more power and in my opinion is more refined due to electric upgrades.
Both versions of m5s are great cars but the e28 was the most fun!! The e34 my buddy has is still kicking and he'll give a kidney before selling it. My apologies for rambling. Go after a closer to stock example and do you homework. PM or email if I can help any further.
my only advice is to do your HOMEWORK on the e34 m5, definately get a third party vehicle inspection and try to lean towards examples that are very close to stock form. Though a very good car the e34 m5 can be very expensive to make right. I can't stress CARFAX check enough, a lot of these cars have/carry salvage titles due to accidents, theft etc. Most of the sellers won't tell you that as they are trying to flip the car.
I've owned and recently sold a 91 stock e34 m5. I found it on autotrader. It was out of Mass via Cali, one owner for 11k with 130k miles and a ton of paperwork. I sold it to a very good friend after I tracked down and purchased 01 Dinan 540i 6spd out of Ohio. I was looking for an M but couldn't find one with decent miles for 25k. I've also owned an e28 m5 for 2yrs. That one was the most fun. The e34 has more power and in my opinion is more refined due to electric upgrades.
Both versions of m5s are great cars but the e28 was the most fun!! The e34 my buddy has is still kicking and he'll give a kidney before selling it. My apologies for rambling. Go after a closer to stock example and do you homework. PM or email if I can help any further.
I think that's certainly the going rate for an 'appreciated E34 M5'.
You're seeing more and more of these cars with Engine and Transmission builds listed in their ads...When you throw names like Blanton/Fahey/etc. in the description, I really think it does a lot to the cars ultimate value.
The E34 and the E39 M5, obviously, couldn't be more different dynamically and in personality. This should certainly be noted, and there is certainly an element of 'specialness' that the E34 possesses for being the last of the hand assembled über saloons.
As mentioned above though, do your homework. They can be painfully expensive.
You're seeing more and more of these cars with Engine and Transmission builds listed in their ads...When you throw names like Blanton/Fahey/etc. in the description, I really think it does a lot to the cars ultimate value.
The E34 and the E39 M5, obviously, couldn't be more different dynamically and in personality. This should certainly be noted, and there is certainly an element of 'specialness' that the E34 possesses for being the last of the hand assembled über saloons.
As mentioned above though, do your homework. They can be painfully expensive.
These are all excellent points. I've been very fortunate thus far in my ownership of my e34 m5. The one thing I've noticed about these cars and its sort of like porsche owners... Most of these folks really take care of their cars. A lot of pride and in some cases probably over due it. Now, that doesn't mean you can scratch the due diligence either in your buying process. Get to really know the owership history and stay clear of florida or texas cars. A lot of flood and rust damage.