Hello all, that may seem like a stupid question but I wanted to know if there is some kind of datalogging devices available for the M30 for viewing engine parameters like timing advance, airflow readings, knock counts? I own a 92 Eagle Talon TSI (a turbocharged all wheel drive little bomb ) and with a Pocketlogger, that makes tuning the car a lot more easier, too easy sometimes!
The reason I ask this is because I just bought myself a 5-speed 88 535i for a turbo project. Also, can we modify the AFM on those cars to compensate for larger injectors? With my Talon, we can hack the lower portion of the mass air sensor to bypass some air and thus be able to get away with running more boost. We then compensate with a potentiometer wired to the barometric and temp. resistor to regain some idle. And the Pocketlogger helps by monitoring all engine parameters for a safe tune. I want to be able to do the same thing with my 535i.
On a side note, never thought those cars had such a great handling! I just redid the whole front end on my Ford Probe GT (and that car handled great from the factory) but it's not even comparable to my BMW, with stock 100 000 miles suspension components! As for the Talon, not much handling there, more of a straight-line stop-light racing machine!
The only unit that I know of that will do it on the 80s-vintage, 60s-technology Motronic 1 is a place called RaceLogic based in the UK. You don't want to waste your time researching it, though, because it's like $2k, IIRC. Maybe more than that.
I did some research on building an emulator to plug into the socket for the chip so that I could modify the chip parameters with a laptop, but I ran out of time and money to do it at the time. I still have a desire to do that, but it'll be at least a year or two before I can find the time to get started. I'll have to start back from scratch since I've forgotten most of what I had learned.
I think that, even with the setup I was going to use, you still have to cut off the car to change any of the parameters. I don't think our ECU has the capacity to be updated on the fly like that.
You COULD go with a TEC3 like Duke is, though. That would give you a good starting point, and it's ONLY about a grand or so.
Would anyone like to provide some insight on the TEC3?
Shifty,
Correction on the "no on the fly change". You can with a emulator. You can mod maps and anything that is not core code related while the car is running.
Mono, the AFM can be moded for larger injs and airflow. There are many here, including myself that have done this. Im currently running an APEXi AFC-II on my AFM, and it works great. Data logging is only a money problem. There is no ODB port on these cars, so logging is just a matter of more electronics to do it.
[QUOTE="Shifty"]Would anyone like to provide some insight on the TEC3?[/QUOTE]
From the TEC 3 website -
Engine Management System
The new TEC represents the current in state-of-the-art fuel injection and direct ignition control integrated into one revolutionary package. The TEC is a PC-programmable engine control system featuring a powerful Windows-based tuning environment. Converting from carburetion to fuel injection has never been easier than with the TEC. Whether you choose to run throttle body injection, multi-port, or individual throttle bodies,the TEC will provide you with the ability to tune your engine to its peak capabilities.
Street enthusiasts will enjoy the benefits of a distributorless ignition system that not only is infinitely adjustable, accurate, and powerful, but also gives you improved firewall clearance and freedom from all those ignition amplification boxes that you used to run in the past. If you are running an aggressive profile camshaft, idle control has always proven to be problematic for lesser engine management systems, but not for the TEC. Within the WinTEC software resides our exclusive TPS/MAP Idle Blend table. With a few clicks of the keyboard, you will enjoy an idle quality that other engine management systems only dream of having.
For competition and ultra high output engines, the sophistication and power of the TEC system simply out-performs other production and aftermarket systems. With full control of the engine over all possible operating conditions, outputs that will control nitrous, boost, VTEC, and other devices, new rev-limiters with Triple Smooth technology, and On-Board Data Acquisition, the TEC gives you Total Engine Control...and makes the competition green with envy!
The TEC Engine Control Unit
The new TEC ECU incorporates the winning features of our previous TEC-2 system while adding an abundance of new features and a powerful new processing platform. Electronic Fuel Injection (EFI) control and patented digital Direct Ignition control is standard hardware for every TEC3. The anodized, laser-etched ECU with waterproof OEM style connectors and harness may be mounted under the hood or in the passenger compartment and will activate separate multi-coil DFUs (Direct Fire Units) mounted adjacent to (or on) the engine.
Standard features built in to the TEC:
PC programmable and configurable for 1, 2, 3, 4, 6, 8, cyl. engines and Rotories with a 12 cyl.and 6 cyl dual plug option
Operate in Open or Closed loop
Run True Sequential, Phased Sequential or Simultaneous Injection with individual cylinder trim
Configurable for TBI, MPI, TPI and individual throttle bodies
Additional Injector Output Drivers built-in.. Run Low or High impedance injectors
Full 150 mJ of Spark Energy directly to the plugs without misfire
New Dual Rev Limiters with Triple Smooth Technology.. 1st step retards timing to a negative -12 degrees.. 2nd step cuts coil current in half.. 3rd step coil current and fuel are cut-off.. all three steps occurring within milliseconds!
Waste Gate (Boost Control), Nitrous Control with up to 4 stage retard available
Four Programmable GPOs (General Purpose Outputs) to control or activate VTEC, Shift Lights, Water Pumps and Fans, A/C Compressor, Torque Converter and more.
New Programmable Adjustable Electronic Tachometer Output
Uses primarily GM type sensors
Diagnostic monitoring with codes issued through Check Engine Light
Easy to install bolt-on Trigger Wheel and Mag Sensor Kits available for many applications
Made in the USA
New On-Board Data Acquistion Adjustable Sample Rates up to 100 samples per second Simultaneously record data from up to 25 inputs including: Air/fuel Ratios, Injector Duty Cycle and Pulse Width, RPM and Throttle Position, Gear Position, MPH, Boost (manifold pressure) and much more!
Additional configurable Digital and Analog Input Channels View Multiple Data Graphs side by side or Graphs may be overlayed for comparison Graphic Screen Displays may be Printed and
Data may also be exported to a Spreadsheet program for further analysis Data Logging can be started and stopped manually using a switch, or the system can be configured to automatically start and stop via values pre-set by the user
You name it, TEC3 can do it. And it is easily over $2K for the full meal deal.
There are many here, including myself that have done this. Im currently running an APEXi AFC-II on my AFM, and it works great.
So an AFC will work on those cars? Great. I know that it cannot change airflow readings at WOT on some cars because their ecu doesn't rely on the MAF then but instead, on predetermined fuel and timing maps. So an E28 is not one of those cars.
But how do you know when you get too much timing advance from the ecu seeing a lot less airflow?
The only unit that I know of that will do it on the 80s-vintage, 60s-technology Motronic 1 is a place called RaceLogic based in the UK. You don't want to waste your time researching it, though, because it's like $2k, IIRC.
Wow! That's not cheap, a little more than I could handle for my little project. A TEC III would be too much also. Maybe a Megasquirt will do the trick. I'll try with an AFC at first and work from there.
Anyone know if 450 cc/min injectors from a DSM (Talon, Eclipse, Laser) would work? They're like 43 lb/hr and low impedance. And they're dirt cheap!
[QUOTE="Monotalonawd"]Anyone know if 450 cc/min injectors from a DSM (Talon, Eclipse, Laser) would work? They're like 43 lb/hr and low impedance. And they're dirt cheap![/QUOTE]
They definitely won't work on a 535i, because the 535i has high impedance injectors.
Another question is whether or not the connector on the DSM injector is compaitble with the injector connector on the 535i wiring harness.
What most 535i owners looking for higher flow injectors do is go with some Bosch replacement injectors that were available on many Mustangs. Therefore, we fittingly call them Mustang injectors.
Um, to use the Apexi, you need to cut the WOT switch to the DME. The E28s do ingnore the AFM @ WOT. Just cutting the signal will keep the DME in the Part throttle map, and stay under AFM control. Thats what Duke and I have done.
Timing advance is another issue. The DME has limited capability to retard. So custom programming is needed at the upper end of the maps to compensate for boost.
They definitely won't work on a 535i, because the 535i has high impedance injectors.
Shifty, I went to the link you provided. A set of six 42 lbs Green tops Lightning injectors retails for $322.55. As that seems like a good price, my "unwillingness" to buy others injectors comes from the fact that I have those (dsm) free injectors laying around.
I know for a fact that non-turbo dsm's use 240cc high impedance injectors. When they convert to turbo, they use the low impedance 450cc's of the turbo model with the turbo's resistor box. So theorically, I could use my injectors on the 535i but with six resistors inline with the harness. That's how cheap I am! :p But thanks for the link, I'll know where to look up when I'll fry up my injectors wiring!
I know Bosch style connectors fit on the dsm's (they also fit on the Mazda Rx7 550cc's I have now on the Talon) but the question is will it fit on the BMW fuel rail and manifold. I'll keep you all informed when I'll disassemble the top end of the M30.
Timing advance is another issue. The DME has limited capability to retard. So custom programming is needed at the upper end of the maps to compensate for boost.
russc, how do you get away with the timing issue? Do you have a custom burnt chip? I see that you have a turbo Dinan edition E28, so was the ecu already reprogrammed?
Again, sorry for all those questions! I am selling my 93 Probe GT to finance my turbocharging project so I want to see what's ahead in advance because I'll lose a great little car in the process!
N.B.: That Probe was the car the S-AFC would'nt work on. Tuners on Probetalk.com have to resort to a stand-alone for fuel management on the klde v6.
) and with a Pocketlogger, that makes tuning the car a lot more easier, too easy sometimes! 
